Grand Designs Podcast – Episode 10 – Professional Athlete’s Salaries Transcript

[00:00:00] You’re listening to the Podcast Detroit Network visit http://www.podcastdetroit.com for more information.

This is Grand Design podcast with DJ and Jerry Grand that we link the chains of reason of sports, politics and culture.

[00:00:33] Welcome to The Grand Design Podcast, episode 10. I’m DJ Grand. I’m here with my brother, Jerry.

Jerry: Hello

DJ: and our engineer, Ryan

Ryan: hello

DJ: To get ahold of us, you can go to our website at Granddesignspodcast.com, Our email is Granddesignspodcast@Yahoo.com, you can follow us on Twitter @Granddesignspod and on Instagram @Granddesignspodcast. Today, we’re going to be talking about professional sports [00:01:03] salaries and whether if they are exacerbated too much, if they earn it, deserve it.

Jerry: Yes, have they gone too high in the last three weeks three major league players some actually Big Fish Manny Machado with the San Diego Padres signed a 400-million-dollar contract. I do not recall how much was guaranteed but it was quite substantial but was over I believe 10 years then Harper came the next week for 440 million.

[00:01:33] And Trout just sign one, this past week for 460 million and the question has become at what point or is there a limit at the salaries? Is paying someone almost 40 million dollars a year to play a kids game has that exceeded the limit

DJ:  You could be wrong, but I got Trout making 426 million Harper at 330 million and Manny Machado at 300 million.

Jerry: Okay, we’ve all had all right. Maybe I went a little bit too high was 300 million from Machado.

DJ: Yeah Machado.

Jerry: Okay, [00:02:03] All right, and then for

DJ: for Harper it was 330 million and Trout was the biggest went for on 426 (million).

Jerry: Okay, that would equate to like 36 million a year. Does it say the guaranteed contract money in that?

DJ: No, it just has a length and the average which is 35 million a year.

Jerry: Is that too high? Is that too much? But that’s what the question that’s out there right now. Is there a limit because I’ve heard people say, you know, you know 1 or 2 million, 5 [00:02:33] million a year? That’s okay. $10 million, people started getting a little upset and then when you get to where they’re at right now at 30 million dollars a year now, this is record numbers right now again, it’s baseball. Football hasn’t quite got that high yet. But that’s soon to follow.

DJ: Well, you say ten million’s too much. What’s the threshold of it becoming too much?

Jerry: I’m asking, yes.

DJ: That’s arbitrary. I mean who sets that that’s too much? Who says that 15 million not too much?

Jerry: That’s the scary part because you know what the government stepping in [00:03:03] but you have a lot of people I mean,

DJ: Even the people saying it, it’s arbitrary

Jerry:  I guess they would be fans and radio hosts, media. Basically, we’ve come to a point that a boiling point is always put that it’s too high.

DJ: Okay, why is it too high? That’s just why it’s arbitrary. They’re just saying it for no reason at all. What makes it too high? What is the standard of value that says that’s too high?

Jerry: Well, I think they’re kind of, I don’t want to say jealous, but they’re comparing their salaries with [00:03:33] teachers. What do they make? Kind of like $40,000 if that.

DJ: probably 40,000 year

Jerry: but it’s also even police officers. I’ve heard thirty-four thirty-five thousand. So, when they’re putting in the context of you got professionals police officers teachers, that’s a kid’s game. Baseball is just a kid’s game and these guys are getting paid thirty-six million to throw a baseball,

DJ: but they’re getting paid what the market demands if the market didn’t demand the 430 million, [00:04:03] he wouldn’t have gotten it. The market is demanding that the teacher gets paid what the market demands. I mean when the government steps in and says a teacher should be paid High that’s an arbitrary, or higher, that’s an arbitrary statement by the government because not putting any value behind it. What gives it value is the market and if you’re just going to just randomly say throw out a number then your you are being arbitrary and therefore, not using reason.

Jerry: Then what is upsetting the fans or the media [00:04:33] because of these contracts? Because it’s almost becoming, I don’t want to say a Witch Hunt because it’s not really that, but there’s some exacerbation that we’ve exceeded the norm. We stepped out of reality and we’ve exceeded what should be the norm

DJ: They’re jealous cause they can’t do it. They can’t play baseball and get paid for it.

Jerry: I wonder if they were making that money or if they hit the lotto that have that same attitude.

DJ: With me myself, if I could still play hockey, I would be happy with a hundred million. I mean a hundred thousand a year. That’s just but that doesn’t mean I wouldn’t take more I [00:05:03] mean, I think they’re jealous.

Jerry: I think anybody would take if it was offered to them that they would take more and they would definitely change but the reality is they don’t do that and it’s a very rare, rare percentage for these guys to get the super stardom to where they get the actual big-ticket. It’s not every player in the major leagues that’s going to make this money. It’s just a few.

DJ: Couldn’t you say that with just about every single profession that only the rare ones…I mean because you want to go over teaching or the rare ones get to be the college professors who make the most money. [00:05:33] I mean only the rare one’s get to be the commissioner of police, the commissioner of police force. They make the bigger money. I mean in all of them when they get to the top of their industry, they make more money. That’s called hard work

Jerry: I guess the outrage is with the being almost like a lottery ticket because if they won the lotto they wouldn’t have a problem with it. But when these guys sign these lotto ticket type, you know half of billion dollars in it the length of the contract which [00:06:03] is not quite that before on 26 million.

DJ: Okay, I get the closeness of the analogy of being a lot of ticket but there’s a difference between the two. A lotto ticket is luck

Jerry: very much so

DJ: and Mike Trout, I would say he earned it. I mean he earned it by putting in the hours by it was from kid on up until now to get it wasn’t just one happening thing that got him there. He didn’t happen to be the right place the right time. He earned it by hard work. So, there’s a [00:06:33] difference between luck and hard work.

Jerry: I would agree with someone else will say it may be lucky that he was given that talent. Actually, because some people just aren’t athletic and they don’t have that opportunity another opportunity out to make that kind of money.

DJ: I don’t think you’re born anything. I think it’s this nature versus nurture. No, there’s no dichotomy there it’s both and I think you have to train to become that good. You’re not just born with the baseball bat in your hand and you’re automatically able yeah, some people are more inclined and it’s [00:07:03] easier for them, but they still have to hone their skills. I don’t think you’re born with anything in any endeavor you have to learn to do whatever we’re talking about.

Jerry: It’s rare when a player they call a five-tool player run, hit, bat, steal. There’s five tools; that what Mike Trout is. They’re saying, he’s the first since Mickey Mantle. That’s what I mean by that rarefied air.

DJ: What makes you think he didn’t earn it? I mean, I don’t think he was just I’m not that I think he had I work hard. We’re talking sweat hours both when he was a kid and growing up through [00:07:33] college and professional.

Jerry: I think the minute he signed that contract he earned it

DJ: He earned it long before that. He earned it by putting in the hard work by putting hours

Jerry: But afterwards as I listen to talk shows, read some articles on the Internet. It’s just not going over well. I mean how the size of it

DJ:  Not going on the not going over one with whom?

Jerry: too much with fans. Again, we’re talking media and fans mostly cause that’s what I’m talk shows in Detroit. That’s one of the topics was it has a gone to a point to where it with [00:08:03] exceeding it and then even brought up to where it could get not topic here, but they were comparing that we haven’t gone to the Moon yet. We’re going to pay…

DJ: We haven’t gone to the moon? Did they haven’t skip over 1969?

Jerry: Stephen Curry did something crazy and said in an interview this year that we haven’t he believe he actually meant that we have not gone to the moon. It’s all TV. He was all edited it. Yes, Crazy

DJ: OK, the world isn’t round either.

Jerry: OK, there are, I forget who just some athlete just came out and said, yeah, it’s flat. I think [00:08:33] it was Kyrie Erving. I’m not sure.

DJ: Well, I wish those people would go to the edge where it is flat and fall off but didn’t show me that it’s truly is flat. Anyways…

Jerry: But again, it just comes to that outraged that we’ve come to a point to where someone’s making almost 40 million a year and it’s a what they call kids game. Again, once he signed the contract, he earned it. He’s worth it. Obviously, the market bears it and the TV money, the revenue. The Angels never would have signed him to this had he not been worth it to them. So [00:09:03] I agree that he’s worth it. But I am just hearing I’m going to say out of six callers out of 10, you have guys out there that are saying no. He can get what he can get, but the majority is kind of coming from no way. You know, that should be given out to where…one even brought up that that’s how Ortego-Cortez can fund her 90 percent tax bracket with the only sports athlete that they should give their 90% to the government, which is a whole other.

DJ: We’ll talk about that a little later in this podcast, but let’s [00:09:33] now get to the worth part of it because I don’t think it’s a matter of necessarily worth. Yeah, he’s worth it to the California Angels. But it’s also a matter of the market Had the market could not bear it, he we wouldn’t be paid that. Had the fans not shown up not just California Angel fans, but Major League Baseball fans, had they not shown up and paid their money to set the market. He would never be able to get to be able to pull in that kind of money. I think it’s [00:10:03] a matter of the market bearing it. It’s not a matter of, it’s not just a matter of worth.

Jerry: I couldn’t agree because actually they’re saying because he’s on the west coast major league baseball has a problem marketing right now and he’s their marketing player, but he does not want to be marketed. He just wants to play baseball. So, he’s not out

DJ: Goof for him.

Jerry: Yeah, I completely agree. They are talking the Yankees. They want to bring him to the east coast where he would have been even more money. But because you get on the East Coast, you have to wait till eleven o’clock to watch him play. He [00:10:33] had it much tougher playing on the west coast but he doesn’t care. He’s made his money but the angels that Major League Baseball that’s why I was surprised the Angels even signed him because I thought for sure he was coming to the east coast because Major League, I’m surprised because they didn’t get their hands in it, they didn’t dictate like other leagues have about trades where players go. They let him stay out there, even though they’ve asked him to come east. They could Market him.

DJ: So, the fans are upset, now, over his 430-million-dollar contract [00:11:03] and he went to the Yankees to get even more, would they be having a conniption?

Jerry: Yeah, they’re our age right now in Detroit over Stafford’s contract because on his performance because these contracts are, you’re not paid for future performance your paid on past performance.

The only future is that they’re guessing hoping that you’re going to live up to the expectations. But a lot of times they don’t

DJ: I think it’s a little of both. You are paid on past performance absolutely, but they’re also hoping that you’re going to continue and that’s why they’re giving you the money. So, I think a little both [00:11:33]

Jerry: Correct and as you continue you’ll bring the organization money.

DJ: Yes,

Jerry: So,

DJ: it’s an investment.

Jerry: I don’t think there is no limit because every year we hear these contracts keep (getting) bigger and bigger. When the NFL starts after the draft and then we get into free agency, you’re going to see some contracts that are going to be… Antonio Brown, he just got rewarded with I didn’t get the contract with the Raiders just signed him for an exorbitant (amount) I think was 84 million.

DJ: They don’t reward for not playing a year.

Jerry: But here we go with the NFL is [00:12:03] only couple years, correct? Well actually him and Le’Von Bell played the Steelers to a T. It was all about money.

DJ: Well, that’s right, it was Le’Von Bell, not Antonio Brown. That’s right. That’s right.

Jerry:  they’re saying he sat out and lost 14 million because he sat out last year, but actually he got more of a guarantee that he would have got in Pittsburgh. With Antonio Brown, he orchestrated that whole thing.

DJ: why isn’t that too much? I mean, what is this arbitrary line that says that isn’t too much?

Jerry: See hear, now that at the point when [00:12:33] he signed that contract there was outrage for what he’d done. He got too much. It was said it was too much for his actions, but the second Trout sign that contract everything about Antonio Brown got dropped never happened. And now we’re talking 84 million now, he just signed 400 million and this is after Harper and Machado signed the 300 million-dollar contracts. So that was just stirring the pot and I know the agent. I think it’s Scott Boras. He was waiting until those two signs. We could go much higher and [00:13:03] he did but that’s why she’s got forgotten about and that’s really our society when something comes up. We just forget about what’s currently what was going on. The government is kind of likes that one sports because we’re not paying attention and are staying on the ball over here and we’re paying attention to how its salaries and getting outraged when there’s other things that we should really be.

DJ: That doesn’t make sense to me because baseball is only the second-highest average salary. NBA is the average salary is 6.2 (million) this was out in 2016. So, we’re talking a couple years ago, but 6.2 million the average salary and [00:13:33] average salary of Major League Baseball is only four point four million. Why? where’s the outrage for basketball and LeBron James? Where’s the outrage for what he makes?

Jerry: they brought that up now. It’s not the outrage for LeBron James because claiming he’s the king, the goat. Okay, they claim him to be worth it, which is a contradiction. But with the NBA the problem is you got guys on the bench, that are getting these six figures. It’s ridiculous, but it’s because the TV money the NBA has got a ridiculous contract with uh, I think TNT and ESPN that just paid them an exorbitant amount [00:14:03] that all the teams got and I think the Nets are paying their tenth man, I forgot, I don’t want to quote it and tell you the podcast but it’s a six-figure salary. He’s a tenth man on the bench

DJ: What allowed them to get that TV contract?

Jerry: Well, obviously is exposure. ESPN wants to…

DJ: the market, the market allowed it to happen. If there wasn’t if the fans weren’t there buying the tickets paying the merchandise, they wouldn’t have that market. [00:14:33] They wouldn’t have the money.

Jerry: after the Larry Bird and the Magic Johnson era, basketball kind of tanked a little bit and only recently they really rebound to where it’s become to where it’s one of the most popular televised Sports most watch sports and those salaries even going to go higher but they’re going to exceed baseball very soon

DJ: still the market

Jerry: so, what will happen now we’ll see about the outrage there. I have to agree because they don’t seem to be an outrage as much of the NBA players as it is with the Major [00:15:03] League Baseball and NFL players.

DJ: We don’t have to stop there? There’s also Floyd Mayweather and what about the money he made I mean, this is a to 2018, but he was making 285 million with 10 million in endorsements. I mean what saying that’s too much? and then there’s MMA with Conor McGregor. He made a boatload of money. What saying that’s what he makes is too much. I think Conor McGregor is $99 million.

Jerry: I guess it’s a good question is why is those off the radar? Because they’re not even watching it as I’m being brought [00:15:33] up. It’s almost like an accepted. Okay.

DJ: Do you think, Ryan, that kind of McGregor’s making too much?

Ryan: I mean you could say that but it’s again, I guess, you know saying what you’re saying about the market because he can just with the confidence. I see as the same with like Floyd Mayweather and stuff like that. It’s like they can know that they’re going to be pulling in these kinds of numbers for pay-per-view and you know, just hyping up the shows and stuff compared to [00:16:03] so many other Fighters.

DJ: You make it the market.

Ryan: Yeah. Well mean they really can just end the argument there and it just like they’ll make that much money because they know it’s going to happen

DJ: take that away from it, do you think he’s worth 99 million for what he does?

Ryan: you know, it’s like he’s a great fighter and all that. But yeah, he’s definitely not like my favorite in that sense and like I mean, it’s so weird, especially with like MMA and boxing and all that since it’s like an individual not a team. [00:16:33] So, it’s crazy because it’s like everybody’s working so hard in that business, especially when you get up to those levels, but

DJ: you said it working hard to get there. They earned it by all that Sweat Equity they put into it. Would you accept 99 million if you got up there?

Ryan: for sure. Yeah exactly.

DJ: That’s the point

Ryan: they do that for a reason so

Jerry: they did work hard they trained but they both all these Mayweather’s,

DJ: Not just them, even the baseball, basketball they all worked hard

Jerry; I’m only talking about those two though, because they I think they played [00:17:03] the public with that whole pay-per-view because with Conor McGregor be in the martial arts, and he now he can’t kick. I’m willing to bet in the future. You’re going to see Floyd Mayweather. I’ve heard about him coming to the MMA and it just for a pay-per-view draw.

Ryan: Yeah because Mayweather may never do that because he’s smart and that’s like what’s that whole thing was such a joke to me like it was it was basically a money grab

Jerry: I thought it was a joke to begin with

Ryan: watch for it to happen. But it just like was such a it just seemed like a cartoon almost, you know, like

Jerry: so for the money [00:17:33] that they made for them and they pulled in a lot of money would

Ryan: They got my money

Jerry: did they I mean do they earn that mean? Was it really? I’m talking was it worth it to you and

DJ: if they paid it, they earned it.

Ryan: But yeah, but I don’t think so because it’s just like it was such like a you know, it was like a movie skeptical thing. It almost didn’t have to and I don’t really even watch Boxing that much but it’s like they went over to this whole Arena where it’s this is a it was a sanction boxing match with you know, Floyd Mayweather that obviously is the best of the best boxing. Yeah, you’re [00:18:03] in that and then Conor McGregor even though he’s a good fighter. He’s not a boxer and he just walked in on the top floor that all these people are probably going like the heck is that guy just standing in there with one of the greatest of all time, you know, even though he lost know that it didn’t even matter, you know, it’s like yeah, they had obviously all the you know, fighting back and forth off the you know, I’m the on TV and stuff but it just like it was an act.

Jerry:  Well, that’s what it feels.

DJ: Absolutely.

Ryan: That’s what I think that’s what they wanted.

Jerry: That’s what I picked [00:18:33] up on it. At first. I was like you how’s it going to happen when I saw their press tour, you know from city to city

Ryan: Yeah.  It was a circus.

Jerry:  Oh, my yeah that that’s why I like these guys are just taking every one of these pay-per-view people to the tank, I mean to the bank and laughing about it because I think you’re right. It was just it was almost to, how is going to compete with Mayweather being like you said the best of all time?

Ryan: and again, he just walks away from it. You know, he’s like it’s like he you know, who knows he might do one but I doubt it and it’s just like he’s just out of that, you know it [00:19:03] he’ll be doing MMA and stuff like that and again even at his last one, you know, that was like a whole thing in itself, but you know, it’s just so weird, you know, it seemed like WWE and wrestling, you know, it’s like

Jerry: exactly

DJ: what makes you guys think that it wasn’t a marketing tool for both Sports at the same time

Ryan: absolutely

DJ: and including the tour beforehand. How’s it any difference from advertising?

Ryan: Well, that’s why Mayweather won’t go to the other side. Like he won’t go in the Octagon because that he’s smart.

DJ: He’ll lose.

Ryan: He’ll get hurt I’m [00:19:35] like his body and his well-being as his money maker.

DJ: It’s a highly valuable, he doesn’t want to ruin that.

Ryan: Yeah,

Jerry: right now, he’s doesn’t have to work again,

Ryan: exactly so, there’s like you can throw them numbers. But

Jerry: but you see…

DJ: I think those guys before they didn’t have to work with $99 million you don’t have to work again

Jerry: Correct, but with boxing MMA and look at the movies, it’s considered entertainment. And for some reason the I don’t want to say majority but public and media. Okay, it’s [00:20:05] alright.

DJ: Well you like the sports not of her kids’ game the both sports but take that away. What’s the difference between a lot what allows boxing and MMA to have pay-per-view and NFL MLB to not? No one would or very few people would pay to see a single game in major league baseball or a single game of football and I think the nature of the market that allows MMA and boxing to flourish [00:20:35] on pay-per-view and grabbing the money where the nature of the market doesn’t and the other side.

Jerry: I think that’s going to be changing because the NFL’s talking about streaming games now more than they had before

DJ: streaming games isn’t quite the same as and as pay-per-view.

Ryan: UFC now is on ESPN and all that stuff. So there you have seen that I know in that weird area where they might not be having pay-per-views.

DJ: Yeah, because the moving into the mainstream or and that’s what’s going to take it away. That’s what I meant by the well that market [00:21:05] allows it with each one each particular sport. It wouldn’t be allowed in any other Sport and now that they’re moving away from it you’re probably will only see it in boxing. WWE that’s pay-per-view to but I think it’s the nature of the market that allows them to make that kind of big money as long as it’s a single event.

Jerry:  as long as there’s TV Revenue to whether we would pay big contracts and the fans keep going to the game. Absolutely. As long as these owners are going to make billions by paying Millions. They’re going to keep doing it and they’re going to get higher

DJ: even [00:21:35] the pay-per-view what puts the gas to the pay-per-view? The people watching it, people taking out their wallet and put it in the man Port. That’s the market if the market wasn’t there it wouldn’t happen.

Ryan: And that’s the thing. It’s like it’s I guess just with boxing and MMA and stuff. You don’t have to see every fight and you can kind of you know map out what you’re going to see if you see two fighters and whatever it is that I’m gonna buy that pay-per-view for that month and you might not buy [00:22:05] it and next couple months, but you’re always going to get that cable bill and that whatever bill that you’re you know, that’s where all that money goes in and the my understanding

DJ: that’s absolutely right. That’s absolutely right

Ryan: It all kind of is the same thing in a sense.

DJ: It makes it easier for them to pay for because it isn’t the cable bill. It’s convenient.

Jerry: but in society, why is it acceptable for a movie star to make Jim Carrey 30 million a movie? And that there is no outrage for that whatsoever. Not that I’ve heard of that could be wrong. Maybe [00:22:35] it’s a minute minority that I actually complain about it. But when an athlete signs it there’s outrage and we’re talking anger to

DJ: Well, I have a lot of problems with Jim Carrey but the amount of money he makes is not one of them.

Jerry: I agree. What’s the difference?

DJ: It’s what the market can pull it and if he can get it, great.

Jerry: Why is it acceptable for one? And the other is an outrage?

DJ: I think it’s arbitrary. I think it’s just based on… people feel jealous.

Jerry: There’s that weird again, arbitrariness

DJ: people feel jealous because [00:23:05] these guys are playing kids sports and they’re getting paid big-time bucks for it and if they could do it most people think they can’t act most people think they can’t sing so they can’t do it. But just about everyone thinks they can play baseball, just about everyone thinks they can they can play football and they’re a little bit jealous because they can’t get that money,

Jerry: I think you’re onto something there exactly that they feel that actually, think they can actually run the team, makes the player Acquisitions, play the GM role and they actually think they actually call [00:23:35] the plays that this person fire the offensive coordinator. I’ve heard him on the radio. I would have called that play. I would have called this play actually thinking that they know more than the coach,

DJ: Do you know what I blame for that? I love video games but Madden

Ryan: Yeah

DJ: NHL whatever year. You think you can play that and you can run your team and you think you’re the greatest I think it’s delusions of grandeur.

Ryan: Yeah

Jerry: Once again, if the fans are so upset, they’re too high. Stop going to the game. Stop paying to watch [00:24:05] them, stop buying their jerseys all that isn’t it their fault? They’re going to these games and after paying what 10 bucks for a Big Boy Burger at Comerica Park? It’s outrageous the prices, they keep going. Yet, they complain when the Ilitch’s go and sign Cabrera’s, he’s in the middle of a horrible contract. He’s making a lot of money.

Ryan: It’s filling a void inside them. So, if they’d stop even if it’s right, you know complaining about it. They would be like nothing to my life now so

DJ: You’re right. You’re [00:24:35] absolutely right

Jerry: so that so that now it become a bitchin point.

DJ: I’m going to bring up capitalism in bit, the difference between capitalism and socialism, but the since you brought the Illitch thing his little thing inside Little Caesars isn’t quite capitalistic because he’s got himself a captive market and because he has no competition he can charge anything he wants for a slice of Little Caesars pizza or you can charge, I mean it works the same in the movie theater to

Ryan: yeah

DJ: you can charge that’s why you pay so much money in a movie theater because they have a captive [00:25:05] audience no competition and they can charge anything they want because they know you can’t go anywhere else to get it and that’s what Ilitch has inside that park.

Jerry: I don’t know about Little Caesars but Comerica there’s a Big Boys in there. So, there’s a little competition because not Little Caesars unless Illitch has some stake in Big Boy that don’t know about

DJ: Oh, I guarantee you, any even in that Big Boys isn’t pizza. So, the competition how many other Pizza things is it does he have in there and big boy is basically hamburgers. Yes, they sell others how [00:25:35] many other hamburger joints are in there and if they’re so it’s not totally open to competition because it’s competition that drives prices down and we have even if you have two in there, okay, it’s still has it causes high prices

Jerry: I haven’t been a Little Caesars but Comerica they’ve actually they have an executive chef now and some of these I guess items are not anything that you’re going to get out in the

DJ: but I guarantee you they will charge more inside there.

Jerry: Oh, absolutely

DJ: Than you can outside because they have a captive market and less competition inside. [00:26:05] What we’re talking about whether it’s Comerica or Little Caesars.

Jerry: That’s what you’re paying nine bucks for a bottle of water because you got no competition

Ryan: Yeah

DJ: that’s the point, that’s not capitalism. He’s got himself. Little tiny Market that allows him to get what he wants…you want to talk about exploitation. They always say capitalism is exploitation, that is exploitation. But he owns it. He’s allowed to do it. I would never make it illegal. the problem I have with this whole entire situation is those who want to rein in the salaries to those who are jealous are [00:26:35] actually being socialistic. I mean capitalism, the moral justification of capitalism lies in the fact that the system is consistent with man’s nature and man’s nature is about it’s about Justice and Justice is not arbitrary. It is just if the market dictates the capitalistic society, all human relationships are voluntary and there is the key because when you’re going to tell me that mike Trout can’t make that money, that’s not voluntary anymore. You [00:27:05] are taking away your using Force into relationship to take away what he has earned by hard work that is not capitalism every single person who is complaining about someone else’s salary is saying, at least implicitly, I’m a socialist. Socialism destroys. If you don’t believe me look in Venezuela right now, the problem with socialism is it uses force. Force is immoral especially the initiation of [00:27:35] force. The what capitalism is, it’s voluntary trade back and forth. It’s a win-win both ways. They pay the money for the pay-per-view and you get the and you get to watch the boxing

Jerry: because they’re upset that Trout’s getting Millions, but yet the owners are getting billions and you’re not hearing anything about the owners literally getting rich off these big contracts and they’re making a lot more money than Mike Trout is Harper, Machado combined. That’s just one owner.

DJ: And if you bring up Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, [00:28:05] she complains about the owners. She complains about all rich people.

Jerry: Yeah, she gets into Bill Gates…

DJ: a socialist they do, they said they’d take them all. In fact, they usually combine them with anyone who is a business owner. If you are a business owner, which they are then you’re bad you’re evil and all your profits should go to the common good.

Jerry: So, I’m taking that’s how China and Russia pays their players

DJ: Oh,  absolutely it’s like the welfare system in our system how we can pay welfare to certain people they do [00:28:35] that to their players. It makes them professionals but under the table professionals

Jerry: because I was kind of curious to how China pulling it off and now with the KHL because they’re actually some Russian players are going back there Pavel Dutzuk just went back there. I think the money it’s not I don’t think it’s ever going to be equivalent, but it was getting

DJ: well have you asked yourself? How is it that China 1970s was dirt poor and somewhat 40 years later, now, they are one of the richest countries? With the resources [00:29:05] all they need. Russia (Soviet Union) collapsed during in the early 90s and yet now the KHL is up making money what allowed them to get back up to there? Both of them adopted capitalistic resources into their system. Both of them brought in parts of capitalism, there not, believe me. I mean, there’s no way you can call communist China capitalism, but what they call it as state capitalism and that is what allowed them to rise. Its capitalism [00:29:35] that a lot that brings back Prosperity is capitalism that allowed Us in the United States to be in the level of luxury at we are right now,

Jerry: I think that’s a problem because when you look at when we hear capitalism now, it says evil, it’s just looks bad. It’s not looked as good. If you’re a capitalist your frown on.

DJ: Once again, it’s the jealousy and a lot of socialism is they want some for free I’m going to or this is going to go off sports, but look at free tuition, College tuition, and [00:30:05] they want something for free. They want something from nothing which is an impossibility in reality in real life. Look at Medicaid for all, they want it, that’s even worse because that tells someone else a doctor a nurse has become a slave to give them what they call is a right to Medical services

Jerry: So that’s Medicare right now.

DJ: It is and that’s the problem with it. That’s why I’m not for and Medicare the problem is it turns legitimate Enterprise into [00:30:35] slaves because they shouldn’t have to be forced to it should be on like I said before win-win

Jerry: Choice

DJ:  it’s not a win-win when you’re forced to do when the government steps in and you must do it at this price and you must do it now to someone else who deserves it. That’s not a when you turn someone into slaves and we look at every VA Hospitals government-run. They’re always the dirtiest they always have the longest lines.

Ryan: They’re pretty bad

DJ: Yes, they are and why because they have implemented socialistic policy.

Jerry: So, when the government tries to control the salaries obviously quality will go down. [00:31:05]

DJ: Absolutely, it will go down. My problem is right now not the government because the government is not doing that yet my problem is with the people. The fans are complaining about it. They’re the ones that are saying it and some of them are unwittingly doing it. They don’t understand that they’re backing socialism.

Jerry: Here we go. This kind of goes into the socialism but some of the fans are okay. Okay, and I’ve heard. All right, let’s Matthew Stafford make 27 million a year, but now he owes he has to give back to the community and you don’t [00:31:35] give if the players don’t give back its good if they do, I get it if they want to get it’s there – spend but if there’s one that doesn’t their lynched.

DJ: Okay, that’s another common misconception. They’re basing that on the sense of a moral duty, a moral obligation. You have to give back

Jerry: that you must you must give your salary because you’re making 10 million a year and I’m only making 40,000 you must give that back to the community

DJ: the problem is the same, have to. The problem is they don’t understand what morality is. In laymen’s [00:32:05] terms, I mean people have written millions of words on morality, but in layman’s terms, morality is a guide for our choices and actions. The operative word there is choice. If you have no choice, you have no morality. Well a choice, an obligation are two exact opposites. They’re a contradiction in terms. There’s no such thing and there can be no such thing as a moral obligation, a moral duty or moral commandment. Look at what all of those do. A moral duty says you have to do [00:32:35] something but more or less no choice. So, Choice-have to. It’s a kind of contradiction. a moral obligation Choice after you’re obligated, a moral commandment. I mean is there a choice? you have to do something. It’s a command. They don’t understand what actual morality is when they say something like that.

Jerry: Some do because now they’re saying you have to when you must give, course, it must be on your own.

DJ: There’s a must there.

Jerry: We’re not we’re not forcing you to give it wink wink

DJ: you are. No, you are that’s a lie. No, you are they should if it’s [00:33:05] done. It should be done on their own free will. That is morality, Choice, free will. There’s no free will, there is no morality. It should be done because…and besides he had if I wanted to give money away, I do because I’m I want to on my own I’m going because I want to be a good person. It’s not because I’m told to do it by someone else. That dampens it. That makes it worse.

Jerry: I agree but we hear that out there that when the players don’t give and most of them do because you have PR agents that just, you know, you it’s going to be worse if you don’t and it’s that whole know it’s [00:33:35] voluntary,

DJ: but it’s not voluntary if they say I have to there’s the contradiction.

Jerry: only one athlete that I’ve heard complain about it. That’s Charles Barkley but their taxes with being a role model because of his position with basketball where he’s at right now. He’s the only one that basically said, I don’t have to do that and he doesn’t which is again I look to him for that and he’s honest about it on TV. He’ll say that during his basketball commentaries how the taxes that he pays and how it’s too high.

DJ: For once someone is honest about [00:34:05] it. Look it’s once again, if you have a choice, you can’t have a duty it’s people just don’t understand what morality is. What it entails.

Jerry: What it boils down to basically we want to keep the capitalistic American way these salaries can’t be controlled and there is no too high.

DJ: I don’t think capitalism goes deep enough because capitalism or your politics is derivative. It’s derived from morality. Okay, we have to get to the moral point of it and [00:34:35] we got to make them understand. If you want to have your free will if you want to have your choice, you can’t have socialism. You can’t have government. Government takes away your choice.

Jerry: I agree. I was reading an article about a job in a bar in New York, where there are three of us customers that are complaining about Alex Rodriguez know he was making 25 million at the time. The bartender defended Alex Rodriguez. He did it by saying to each one of those of all customers. If someone walked up to you and offer you 25 million would you take it for [00:35:05] your profession? Of course, they would now all of a sudden, it’s not so bad. Now. Is it?

DJ: because that’s what socialism is, it is spending other people’s money. Not your own,

Jerry: One of the customers said the most common thing which I think is very irritating: that’s different. I’m not going to get that 25 million offer to me I whatever secretary it’s just not going to happen. It’s not reality. This point was if you’re offered 25 million, if you win that Lotto, you’re not going to say it’s too much like you are right now because he swings a [00:35:35] bat throws a ball

DJ: that’s different. That’s like saying an oak is different from a maple. They’re both trees. They’re not different. They’re not. Once again, I think it goes back to we have to learn to be moral to do and not (just) that fight for our own choice because that’s what being moral is, fighting for your choice

Jerry:  understand work hard and that those rewards may come to you

DJ: but don’t you choose to work hard and didn’t Mike Trout, how we started this off, didn’t he choose to put that sweat equity in?

Jerry: I agree, choice, but I think that’s where part [00:36:05] of the problem is. You have some people saying that there should be a socialism where everyone just gets a salary even if they don’t want to work people believe that that’s a problem.

DJ: They don’t want to work and they want something for nothing. They want something for free

Jerry: and that’s where we get to where it and then you’ll get people

DJ: That’s the problem.

Jerry: Correct

DJ: you lose your choice.

Jerry: That’s where they’re saying, these salaries are too high because they don’t want to put the work in they don’t want to go out there and actually earn that salary.

DJ: I agree and it’s jealousy, arbitrariness

Jerry: So, that jealousy has to stop, you can’t get jealous because someone [00:36:35] got the contract because you didn’t get it. That’s what it boils down to I didn’t get it. So that’s not right

DJ: Go out there and get it in your own profession. Look at Bill Gates. I mean, he just was like the first centi-billionaire or something like that. I mean, he’s not a sports figure. You don’t have to be a sports figure to make that kind of money go on continue on I your Profession.

Jerry: I don’t know how it happened. But uh, Kylie Jenner’s became the youngest billionaire to be called the youngest person become a billionaire how but it happened

DJ: even though I think she’s a vacuum

Jerry: I get it. Yeah,

DJ: she’s [00:37:05] totally empty, but she did. She earned it, good for her.

Jerry: That’s why I brought it up

DJ: She can get two million, she can get two million. Whatever she can get. Whatever the market will bear. She deserves it. I mean even go further as the oil industry if they deserve if the market will bear them to make billions in profits. They should be able to make that and more whatever the market will bear as long as it’s done honest trade win-win capitalism scenario than if the absolute moral thing you can do.

Jerry: I agree.

Ryan: Yeah, that’s like even with we [00:37:35] have these sports figures we’re talking about that. We know their name. We basically know their life and what they do, but then there are these other people that make triple fold of what these people are doing and we have no idea who they are. They could be walking right by us.

DJ: That’s exactly right.

Ryan: You know how they get that money?

DJ: Be that person.

Ryan: Yeah

DJ: choose to work hard. And once again choose-Choice-morality. Choose to put the sweat equity in and choose to learn and above all choose to be a good person.

Ryan: yes

Jerry: I agree. DJ: All [00:38:05] right. Like to tell you how to get a hold of us. Again, the website is GrandDesignPodcast.com; email is Granddesignspodcast@yahoo.com. Instagram is @granddesignspodcast and on Twitter follow us @ Granddesignspod. This is the Grand Designs Podcast. Who are you listening to?

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